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Published on August 12, 2007 By Dan Greene In Current Events
My life intersected a few interesting topics, some recent, some old rehashes, others important but years in the past. I wanted to write on them with some relevance and urgency but not with more urgency, then would be prudent for creating a good understanding and presentation of the facts.

There are some people in our nation who see fit to make argument, that anything and everything we do as a country in our own defense is legal, moral, and ethically correct. Indeed it does depend I guess on the vantage point of the perspective that is being looked from. Nevertheless, our country has in the original historical documents, a declaration of Independence, a constitution, documents that survives to this day. Documents that have been copied and re-made over and over in other constitutions across the free nations on the globe because they resonate with free people and those who would wish to become free.

I listened to a "respected journalist" speak on the topic of Japanese American Internment. She defended the treatment of this group of people, who were 2/3 Japanese American Citizens of the United States, who were, both asked to assembly and forcibly removed from their homes and businesses. This group was "concentrated", "imprisoned", "detained"; whatever team you wish to apply, this is what they were.

Nobody debates the fact of this occurring, which would appear to Freedom loving people in my judgment, both painfully wrong and a significant blemish on a modern free country imprisoning their own citizens as though they were criminals. They were declared political enemies of the state, and though few if any were guilty of any crime. Certainly though the end result was not, the mass systematic extermination of the Japanese people, as in Nazi Germany at the same time, but they were guilty of being Japanese just as sure as Jews were guilty of that.

It is so very sad and tragic that this did occur in our nations history ethically of course because it is wrong to imprison anybody who has not committed a crime. It is certainly wrong to apply a judgment of criminality to an entire group of people for the acts of a foreign government. That laws of war state,

"People and property that do not contribute to the war effort should be protected against unnecessary destruction and hardship."1

Beyond that international law, Our own preamble to the Declaration of Independence reads...
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."2

Our constitution has been established to...

"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."3

Our constitution states...

"Section 2 provides that the trial of crimes, except in cases of impeachment, must be by jury." [Section 2 Of Article 3]

History does not provide that any of that took place for the Japanese American Citizens Interned. These camps were indeed not for criminals or treasonous citizens, but...

"intended for non-citizens including Buddhist ministers, Japanese language instructors, newspaper workers, and other community leaders."

So if you like me, believe that these Japanese American Citizens were in fact illegally, unethically, and not exactly given fair treatment, certainly not due process, then I believe you would agree that this was in fact wrong, morally, ethically, and legally.

If you do not agree, and think that these people actually posed a threat to our nation during a time of war. Similarly to how some believe that Muslims, American Citizens inside our country who worship Islam, are a danger, please explain why they were not removed from the very place where the United States was attacked?

Hawaii

"The vast majority of Japanese Americans and their immigrant parents in Hawaii were not interned because the Government had already declared martial law in Hawaii and this allowed it to significantly reduce the risk of espionage and sabotage by residents of Japanese ancestry. Also, since these individuals comprised over 35% of the territory's population, it was not economically prudent to remove them."1

For those that still need more...

"In December 1944, the Supreme Court ruled the detainment of loyal citizens unconstitutional. In early 1945, the government began clearing individuals to return to the West Coast; on January 2, 1945, the exclusion order was rescinded entirely. The internees then began to leave the camps to rebuild their lives at home, although the relocation camps remained open for residents who were not ready to make the move back. The freed internees were given $25 and a train ticket to their former home and sent on their way. Some of the Japanese Americans immigrated back to Japan, however the majority returned to their former lives, to the very place where they had been openly ostracized.[1] The fact that this occurred long before the Japanese surrender, while the war was arguably at its most vicious, weighs against the claim that the relocation was an essential security measure."1

So we not only exposed here how perhaps our nation was both wrong to intern American Citizens without cause, but also hypocritical and unequal in our exercise of power, and then later made the right decision and found justice. All things considered, it was a devastating war to our enemies, and a turbulent period in history, certainly there have been few instances where ideologies of good and evil became so violently clashed against each other.

The point I wanted to make is this. Detaining people, who don't get a trial, who aren't convicted are just as innocent or not guilty as you or I. If there is evidence against a person committing acts of violence of war or crimes, against this country, let it stand in a court. Let a jury decide, if we truly believe that all men are created equal. We ought to punish those the same way we would punish ourselves brining justice to those who would do us harm in the way we feel is ethical as a people on paper.

I disagree with the defense of Japanese American Internment just like I disagree with interment of anyone in our "War on Terror" who has not been convicted of a crime or is not awaiting a trial. These people, some of them are criminals, terrorists, some are people caught up in the wrong place at the wrong time, rounded up and unable to face trial because we choose to intern them irregardless of evidence against them. That's wrong.

1: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_American_internment
2: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Declaration_of_Independence
3: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laws_of_war
4: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Constitution#Preamble


Comments
on Aug 13, 2007

First, you hit on one of the 2 worst violations against the constitution that this nation has witnessed in its life.  The Internment and the other being Licoln and his suspension of most of the bill of rights during the civil war.

But to compare citizens of this nation with armed combatants - some who have refused to be repatriated is a terrible stretch and has no basis in a logical argument. For going back to the founding of this nation, you see prisoners of war.  In this war, there are not a lot since there are only 2 nation states we have warred against.  But there are a lot of others out there - citizens of countries not at war with us - who have taken up arms against us.  And it is against not only our constitution, but international law to treat them as citizens  subject to our own internal laws.

No, there is no comparison between the Nisei and the prisoners at Gitmo.  To do so is to devalue the tragedy that we did perpetrate on a segment of our citizenry.

on Aug 16, 2007
Actually I had no idea Lincoln suspended Habeas corpus during the civil war thats interesting.

As for comparing citizens of this nation with armed combatants. The American citizens of Japanese descent were detained against their will as security threats by the government. Without trial. The connection to armed combatants is such that if we as Americans believe in our rights as a free people, we should be bringing these criminals to justice or letting them go if they aren't guilty of crimes against us. Not detaining them forever.

I don't think I made any comparisons between Nisei and prisoners at Gitmo. Help me out here Dr.
on Aug 16, 2007
The point I wanted to make is this. Detaining people, who don't get a trial, who aren't convicted are just as innocent or not guilty as you or I. If there is evidence against a person committing acts of violence of war or crimes, against this country, let it stand in a court. Let a jury decide, if we truly believe that all men are created equal. We ought to punish those the same way we would punish ourselves brining justice to those who would do us harm in the way we feel is ethical as a people on paper.


I don't think I made any comparisons between Nisei and prisoners at Gitmo. Help me out here Dr.


I took the above to mean Gitmo. rereading it I can see where my own biases probably read too much into the paragraph, and that it probably was a condemnation of the treatment of the Nisei.

It was apparently my mistake, not your comparison. Sorry.
on Aug 16, 2007
something a lot of people don't know is that German Americans were also sent here to Texas to one or two camps. so it wasn't just the Japanese
on Aug 16, 2007
this does not deminse what happened to the Japanese.
on Aug 16, 2007
'diminish


sorry my spell check couldn't figure it out either.
on Aug 17, 2007
I'm interested to learn that German American citizens were detained as well as that is an education for me. I figured with a vast number of American citizens at the time, tracing their ancestry to Germany, that such an internment would not have taken place.
Beyond that I specifically remember being taught that there was no internment of Germans. Perhaps it was not common knowledge in public schools or teaching circles.

Of course nor the German American or Japanese American citizens were subject to treatment comparable with the treatment received in Nazi Germany, subjected to torturous cruel and unusual scientific experimentation, starvation, enslaved, and murdered etc... because of their religion/culture.

That however does not excuse the conduct of our government then, nor now, if it chooses to detain people who are not proven to be a danger to that government. The government exists to serve us, not the other way around. It is created by the people, of the people, and for the people for the purpose, we citizens, designate. The military of this government is subject to the civilian control, and not to protect itself, but to protect the citizens, from our enemies. We have to prove our enemies to be a danger though before we go denying them their liberty.

I am writing about the idea, that the internment of free people can, can be justified, ethically, morally, legally, which it cannot, without due process or just cause. It is not just to deny free people their liberty. It is a founding principal of our great nation and one we would do well to stick to and uphold.
on Aug 17, 2007
the main difference was that the germans were known nazi backers. where as the japanese only had to be japanese.
on Aug 18, 2007
Hitler was very interested in keeping the United States out of WW2 for as long as possible and entirely if possible. There was a Nazi party in the USA but for most of the pre-war and war it was not supported extensively by Germany. Hitlers primary concern once the war had begun was Defeating Britain, Keeping the USA isolationist, Attacking and defeating Russia. The attack on the communists was, in Hitlers' mind, a plan to remove an ally or potential ally of Britain, because they could not or would not remove the United States because we were separated by an ocean.

I'm not sure if members of the Nazi party in the USA were spying for Germany or not, probably somer were. It is certain that Germany had some spies here and political officials and diplomats, however the picture of America they gave Hitler, or that he took from their views rather, was one of a primarily isolationist society. The Nazi's didn't extensively devote resources to having to keep the USA out of the war or convince us as such because they were right that many people were of isolationist mind.

Given how fanatical Nazism was, it is maybe more likely that those who were detained had done something.

I don't necessarily have a problem detaining someone of a political movement if their activities are treasonous and proved to be so. Or certainly, if they were subverting the economy or industry or spying.

As for the Japanese American citizens, many were forcefully removed from society for no political support of Japan, no sabotage, no espionage, no crime other than Japanese ancestry. How ludicrous and obscenely hypocritical is it that, in Hawaii the vast majority of Japanese Americans were not interned? Especially when they constituted 1/3 of the population of Hawaii, but those on the mainland were?

I can find no reason to detain or intern an entire group of people for the faults of a few or the one. I don't think anyone who is not party to, or directly responsible for actions which harm the government, ought to be interned in this country, the home of the brave and free.

Certainly the defense of such actions, past or present, I think is despicable and deplorable.
on Aug 18, 2007
The Nazi's didn't extensively devote resources to having to keep the USA out of the war or convince us as such


that was japans job